Unlocking Limitless Potential: The Healing Power of Art and Creativity- RV

Hey, one more thing before you go. Art, creativity, healthy dialogue like a podcast, and our adaptability are superpowers that defined our limitless human potential.Creating art always reminds and teaches us of life as human beings. It makes us aware of humans and nature, wonder in the nature's wonders for us as well as future generations.That's the philosophy and the practice of my next guest.In this episode, we're going to explore how art and creativity always brings us closer to humanity and how you have the ability to develop your creative voice. And we're going to help you understand that. My guest in this episode is Michael McGurch.He's an Austrian, Californian, multidisciplinary artist, awareness and creativity educator. He's a speaker and an author. He works on raising the awareness of our limitless human potential and comprehending wisdom. We have a lot to talk about.Michael's an advocate for helping understand neurodiversity. His dyslexia and his dysgraphia. We'll explain all that as we go.Forced him to develop an awareness of seeing the world pure, purely from a human perspective. Creating an art completed his awareness of what it is to be human relevant versus system relevant. And again, we'll discuss that more in depth.Michael's talent is recognizing awareness to seed new consciousness that allows us to unveil the untapped superpowers of humans. Limitless art and creativity, healthy discourse and adaptability to make all humans fit within our human tapestry. I'm Michael Hurst.Welcome to one more thing before you go.

Hi, Michael. Thank you. That was an awesome. We basically can turn off now. Walk off. That was pretty much everything I am. Yeah.Thank you for giving me a canvas to paint.

Oh, absolutely. I think, you know what you bring to the world. As you know, my background is similar to yours in certain aspects.I have a master's degree in interdisciplinary studies with a focus on performance, digital media and art.So we have a lot in common in this arena because we both appreciate the fact that it is interdisciplinary and that all types of creativity, whether it's performance or whether it's painting or drawing or dance, all has a place in our society. So thank you very much for coming on and sharing your journey in all of this. I really appreciate it.

You're welcome. I'm really glad to be here. And I think that, you know, you say you're so brilliant because you could actually fit into systems. So you got a degree?I have pretty much no education other than art, but art is better. I think the best art and humans are the best education that you can get.I don't think there's any Harvard or any top university in the world where you can get the education that you can get from human or from art creating, not from art, looking at it from any creation.

Actually, you know, I agree with that. I think that, you know, we as human beings, we. I think we seek out pleasures in life like music and drama and art and creativity.It allows us to experience life from a different perspective. It allows us to experience life from other people's perspectives. And we can only do that through a human experience. So yes, I do agree with you.It is a. And those of us that are in the creative field, it's deep in our soul. It comes from the heart, comes from the soul.And we put it out here because we want to share that with others. On the same level.

I think the. What you said, I would say like, I would say it like this. I would say art is inherent in us. Art and creation.It is the closest when you create something.And that's why we have the shiny objects syndrome that we think Apple is bigger than the company Apple or McDonald's or Nike or Louis Vuitton or whatever you call it is bigger than we are. And I think we, we creating art gives us. It does two things. Number one, it gives us that feeling that God we create.We can't believe we created this, right? When you, you set up a task and you said, you know, I'm creating a goal that other people's did.So something that you want to like your podcast, right? New thing, you have an inspiration and you create it. And then you say I can't believe I created this, right? I enjoy the podcast, I do whatever.And, and, and that's the God that you get a sense of God. I think you get a sense of what we are capable or our godliness.Because you are not going to be an account, you're not making an accounting company, but you making your part. And the other thing is the fulfillment, the awareness of self and the awareness of the whole.So the awareness of self gives you art creation because you couldn't believe that you unveiled yourself. You couldn't believe you did that, right? It doesn't matter even if it's art or if it's something else.You, you couldn't believe you ever will end up finish that, finishing that or getting in the direction.And the other thing is also seeing that art as a, as a institution, not institution as a common good is for example, when you go to an art opening, it's all inclusive. There's every gender, every race, every level of society. There, people, wealthy people mingle with poor people, with poor artists, for example.And that's for me, when you do all these things, that's why I call it this the first superpower.

Yeah.

Everybody meet us. And nobody looks at the art. It's the funniest. When you look at the art openings, nobody looks at the art.It's just the energy that brings us together. You know, that brings us. And it also. Look what happens when a CEO works 80 hours a week. What does he do on the weekend? He tinkers on his car.He thinkers in the garden. It. It just, it just brings you back to your human essence.

Yeah, I agree.

And I think that's why it's. That's why I coined the first thing is as a superpower creation. The second, what we're doing here. Because.But through relating and telling stories, we grow. We. And we put things into. I would say, yeah, that's. We make it real.Because when you say, okay, you have the same experience that I have, that's more real than if a system says you have to do this to get this.

I agree with that. Yeah, I can.

So that's why I call podcasting the second superpower. So not podcasts. Dialogue. Dialogue. Human dialogue. Healthy, obviously. Not. Not. I'm right, you are wrong. So sis, I'm not a system. Directed dialogue.Where you, where I say it's all about Republicans, you say it's all about Democrats and, and, or vice versa. And then the, the third one is that actually we can survive in these systems and in this world is our adaptability.Otherwise nobody, no human would have survived the holocaust of war.

Right.I think the tenacity of individuals and what we strive to do to keep ourselves on a human level is the use of creativity, no matter what form it comes through, whether it be drama or the art, drama, dance, music. There's a universal language, in my opinion, with creativity from all those perspectives. Because it doesn't.Like you said, you can go in and no matter what area you're from, no matter what socioeconomic level that you're at, whether you're poor, you're rich, or, you know, you're black, you're white, you're Asian, doesn't matter. We can all appreciate the same creativity and do that on a personal level.Because when we look at something, we look at a piece of art, as you know, it's subjective. We all look at that and may see something different that appeals to us individually. And I think that's very unique because it communicates with us.And communication is the key. The key to human beings inter interacting with each other at a level that we all understand each other.So, yes, everything that you just said, Absolutely, 100%. Let's start where your journey. Can we start where you started on your journey? I know. Where'd you grow up?

I grew up in Vienna, in Austria, a very cultured city. And. But it was very systemic, much more than America was 40 years ago. And I had to go, leave.I was, you know, I was a sick child, went to school, couldn't go anywhere with what I. With my dyslexia. And I wasn't even aware about dysgraphia.They just called me at that time, oh, you're dyslexic, but you still have to do your homework and you still have to do your tests and you still have to fit in. And I just couldn't fit in and because I couldn't regurgitate stuff, and I had a hard time.Especially when you're a little stressed, you know, you have to read in front of the class or you have to do a test. You go, all right, with the, with the dyslexia.

Okay, can I, Can I ask you please, to help our. Our listeners. Our viewers understand dyslexia in.

Yeah. This graph.

Yeah. Okay, please.

Dyslexia is where you're. You, Your brain. That's what, you know, that's the latest thing that, where your brain or gets like, ADHD is the first.First you're going anxious, then you go adhd and then you have dyslexia. Dyslexia is the highest. And it's not. Probably not from stress, but it could be a shock, it could be a stress, or it could be.We see that also it's genetic. And what can happen is it whacks you out of time, space, and when you're not in your body, when you're all in your mind and you try to fix your.With your mind, your being, that doesn't work. It's the same thing as when you're a mind construct.When you do a mind construct and you want to understand, you know, like, like you can't predict the future because it's a mind construct. You are right now here, and in one minute I can get a check for a million dollars or I can die. Everything is possible. And that's why mind constructs.And that's what you see so much.Because right now in, in the world, because the systems, our systems, man made systems, all you got to have knowledge about those, all those Monopoly games and they nurture mind constructs. So you got to say, oh, where's this going to go? How it's all strategy and it pulls us out of time space.So this dyslexia is, is basically the future where our world is going to go. And I experienced that when I was little, you know, so. And I still do it. So you switch letters and you cannot determine if you.Let's say that the true that everybody sees the same number is 13. I can have written down 31 and read it as 13. I can also read 13 as 31. So they're both equal.So 31 is not a one and a three, but they're, they're equal and they're interchangeable in my mind. So my perception switches up.

I do understand that in dysgraphia, that's a hand eye coordination on top of.

Eye coordination, meaning when you write something obviously legible five years ago, I can read it, I can read it now. If I write something incursive, not in caps, I have to do it in caps to decipher it. But also I lose context of it, meaning I write something down.And if I.Let's say I'm making notes in this interview and if I don't take the notes, in extreme cases it can be that I can't even after hour hour, I cannot even decipher our notes if I take it usually it takes like a half a day or a day that I can't recognize my cursive writing because I have contextual loss. And, and I. And I can't decipher the writing. So I always need context. That's why I. My dyslexia on the other spectrum is a superpower.And that's why I found why 97 of artists worldwide are in poverty. Because I separated. I thought that because we have to separate art into art, into an art product and into an art in the art creation.And once you separate those, those two and actually in another one in oxy art experience, if you separate art in that, you can make sense why 90, 70% of artists are in poverty worldwide. And, and I see superpower. I mean I, I use dyslexia. I haven't used it before. It was like a burden. I was a victim. I like everybody else.So I hit the wall till I was 50. I just hit the wall. I tried, I did whatever and I pushed with my willpower through. But it really. My life is now even.Nothing has changed financially or I didn't Get a million dollar check or I didn't marry the right woman or anything, but I'm at peace now. Versus before. I wanted to survive every day, I needed to survive every day.

That makes a lot of, I mean it is a journey for anybody.But starting out as a child, having both of that as an obstacle or something that you need to overcome or adapt to adaptability, as you said and we said earlier in the beginning of the conversation, you know, adaptability is the key to overcoming, you know, we have to adapt and overcome in many aspects of our lives. I, you know, as my listeners, viewers know, I'm a retired police sergeant. I was injured in line of duty.I was told to be in a wheelchair for rest of my life. I'm not the wheelchair sitting in the garage and I walk my oldest daughter down the aisle and I'm going to walk my youngest daughter down the aisle.And I had to adapt and overcome. And it seems to me that you have adapted and overcome many obstacles in your life and you've done that through creativity, through art.So does art speak to you at a deeper level, do you think, than it does the average individual or do you think we just kind of society has kind of put that aside?

I think we are unaware, I think to have you said the perfect words, it put it on the side.I think I'm more aware because when I was 30, I, you know, I always struggled, you know, like adolescent first and then we struggled, you know, every, every day basically to survive and, and you find yourself. And at 30 I wrote a, you know, and I couldn't fit into any systems so I had to repeat classes and all this stuff.So I wrote my resume and I saw, oh my God, all my jobs were creative. I, you know, sold tapes in the trunk, did was a dj, produced fashion shows, advertising, television, video. So I was always, always an artist.And then it dawned on me. I think that was one of the major pivot points where I defining myself.It was when I realized I don't need the society or a system to deem me an artist because basically, and that was my unique situation. I couldn't do anything else than art or being creative. So it was me, it was, it was a tool for me to survive. And that's later on.That's why I said I can't believe for me was such a tool to survive and to relate to other humans and to feel as a human being, as being included, that that 97% of artists that I know not only know that all the statistics say on the Poverty level, which is that, you know, art is the highest form of creativity because it doesn't have a purpose. You know, if I create a shoe, you create.You limit already your creativity because you're focusing all on that shoe or on that iPhone or whatever you're going to create. But art is basically, I hear a sound, and then I hear another sound or I hear a rhythm.I mean, I'm a musician too, so I hear rhythms and then I lay the rhythm, and then I just fill in the rhythm till it creates its own life. And that's why I think that pivot point where your song takes over or your paintings takes over is the godliness.And if you give that to your ego, that's the problem. And, and, and most, most people give their creation to the egos to look what I created. No, you completed something and then it became.It got its own through you. You created something and it got its own life.

Yeah, it took out its own life. Yeah, I do. Yeah. It, It's. Did you. If I can just kind of back. Just to backtrack just a second. Had you always. Like, when did you.When did you first pick up a paintbrush, for example? Was it when you hit 50 years old? Or was that prior to.

No, no, no, no. That was around 30. 30, 35.

30 years old.

About that when I realized I was an artist, because then it wasn't important for me that I sell my paintings. I mean, it was. I wanted, at the beginning, I wanted to all be famous and blah, blah, blah, all the system, relevance.But I, you know, as, you know, there's 1% of artists that, when. If 97% of artists are poor, the chance that you're going to be 1, 1 of the 1 and 2% on top is very minute.It's like everybody wanted to be Elon Musk or Jeff Bezos. Right. The. The chance. But this is how we live. This is what society tells us. It's always possible. If Jeff Bezos can it. You did.Yeah, it's possible, but it's probably not that you become that you might be in other Jeff Bezos in another category, you know.

Well, and I mean, like this podcast, for example, you know, I've been doing this podcast for, let me see, 20, 21, 22, but three years now, more than three years now. And in regard to this, in the beginning, I, you know, wanted it to go big and, and in the beginning, it, it took its time like that.Like, all things that you're creating take its time. It evolved and it was created in such a manner that I'm grateful. I'm heard in 59 countries. I am grateful for the audience that I've got.I'm grateful for every time I look at the thing and I see downloads in views.

Nice.

But it's not making me rich. But I love doing it. No, but it gives me purpose. I'm loving what I'm doing. I'm sharing with the world.I hope to motivate, inspire, inspire and educate people with this podcast. So monetary to me. I would love to be, obviously, make a million dollars like everybody else. I'd love to do a deal like Joe Rogan did.You know, obviously, we're two completely opposite individuals, but, you know, I would love to be able to attach that. But it doesn't stop me from continuing to create because I haven't reached that level. It's dear to me.Like I said, like we said earlier, it's in our hearts and our soul to create and to share that with the world and to bring that forward. And it helps us redefine our own purpose.I think, you know, after I got injured and I realized I couldn't be in law enforcement any longer, that's what I went to college for. That's what I dedicated my life to. And my family, they understood that it's who I was, and I had to reinvent my purpose.And in reinventing my purpose, I found that my creativity was a better outlet for me in dealing with my ptsd, in dealing with the stuff that I had experienced through a dysfunctional childhood as well as my law enforcement career. I found that creativity allowed me to manage that and to work through that and deal with that.So I understand where you come from, that art in creativity, in music, in the. The creative endeavors of all aspects within us. Okay.You and I have reached a level within our soul, within our bodies, within our minds, that we understand that that's an innate, innate part of our being and that all we did was open the doors for it to come out.

It's communication, like you said.

Yes, it's our medication, and it's coming.

It's coming. It's medication and communication. Yes, it's both.

It's both.

And. And the funny thing that you said that and I said that. You said a word, and I, you know, because of my dyslexia.You said a word, and I said that the correct word in the human aspect is fulfillment. Because it's like that feeling after an orgasm. After the union.

Yes.

Not about the sex. Forget the sex. It's about after Orgasm, it's the union that you have and that fulfillment that you feel afterwards. And, and this fulfillment is the.You are. It's the feedback, emotional feedback that you just had a union that you were communicating.And that's why art can do is the only part of in that can actually give you the emotion of feeling heaven on earth. I mean, how often did you cry by a song or a movie? It shows our interconnection, you know. And I need to tell you about.Because you were policeman soldiers, and you're kind of a soldier. Right. So soldiers are protectors, and they're also human.One of the best human, you know, the most connected, which I find when I talk to marines and, and, and, and, and personnel. The best humans. The best humans that know instinctively I want to protect the herd.

Yeah. I, I still do. I mean, it's still.

That's why, you know, I could, I, I can see that and hear that. It's. It's protecting the herd. That's an innate thing of your purpose. And they want to serve.And the bad thing is they sacrifice themselves, the protection. They are the best humans because, look, I'm strong. I can protect this beautiful thing that we have as a tribe here. Right.And then they get screwed up from the system, get deployed, put on drugs, get put in positions where they have to kill somebody that they don't even know.

Yeah.

So this is. And, and that's why my next book is about systems and how we use creativity to, to eradicate each other.

Yeah.

Because systems are done by other. It's just our. The buffer. It's the muffler of, of one human against another. And we need to untangle that understanding of what systems do.Systems should serve us, not we serve systems. Human connection needs to be number one. The human interaction needs to be number one. And what's. Where it's still pure is in art.

Right.

It's not pure anymore in soldiering, in policing, because the system has created that environment.

Yeah.

It actually castrates your power. It's your purpose. You have a purpose that you feel in every cell of your body. To protect the soldiers too.

Oh, absolutely. Exactly. Cops and firefighters, EMT personnel, all those. We see people at their worst.We see the best people at their worst, which means we see everybody at their worst. Because when you need a cop, it's either for one or two reasons. You, You're a victim or you're a criminal. You're either a victim or a criminal.And if you're a victim, you're a victim. Either of A crime, whether it be domestic violence, whether it be a robbery, a burglary, murder, assault, whatever it happens to be, you're a victim.Child abuse, you're a victim. So that is your connection to law enforcement or to EMTs or to any of the. The first responder aspect. That's your first connection.You're a victim or you're a criminal. So from that perspective, that's all we see day in and day out.You deal with that part of humanity that, I mean, when you're driving down the road, we call them instant Christians. Forgive me for that, but we call them instant Christians. You see a cop, you don't think, oh, there's a human being.There's a husband, there's a father, there's a wife, there's a. There's a daughter, there's a son, there's a. You know, you don't think this.What you think is, there's a cop, oh, crap, he's going to stop me, you know, and you start doing everything like he's the enemy. And the cops deal with that on a daily, daily basis. Soldiers deal with that. They're there to do a job, but what do they see?They see the worst of humanity, and they see the worst of humanity because they're put into that position. Yes, we chose to do this. We chose to be a protector. We chose because we felt that that was our calling. That was my calling.My calling was to protect and serve. I mean, literally, to protect and serve. I was drawn to law enforcement for what you just specifically said, to protect and serve.I felt that, well, everybody's running that way.I want to stand between that and you so that that doesn't hurt you, you know, as it's coming to you, I'm going to be the person standing in between you and in the danger you and the assault you and whatever it happens to be.So we, once we are out of that, just to follow up with what you were saying, whether you're a soldier, because again, like you said, I'm kind of a soldier. Soldiers, cops are daily soldiers, you know, soldiers that go overseas and fight their daily soldiers. It just sometimes is a little bit different.Different kind of a battle, you know, But I took my life in the hands every day. That's what put me in a wheelchair for four years because I put my life on the line for somebody else.So when you wake up out of that, when we step out of that realm, the system does not give us the tools to manage what we just experienced.

If they would, they had to pay you. And what payment? Every time it comes to payment. And even if they have to pay for psychological or art therapy.

Right, exactly.

It costs money. And every system works on financial principles. Every system, religions, every state, every government, everything.And when it comes to too much money, it's going to be cut. And the system tries to manipulate as long as possible. Because on the other side of systems are also humans that need to pay their bills.And as long as they can, they want to get the most for free. That's what every business you run, you want to get. Keep, keep your people low, keep the cost low and make the maximum profit. And not.That's not in a mean. I don't see it in a mean. I just see human against human. And your job as a. As a soldier is not to fight, kill people, not to, to. To your soldier.That the innate human tribal soldier is the protector against animals that came in against whatever it makes the, that that the human being survive, that the kids can grow up. That is the essential thing of a soldier. Not to kill 200,000 people in Ukraine and Russia. Yeah, that. Where the system says you do that.And people say yes, I have that feeling of protecting. Okay, I'm gonna do this. And I go so far to sacrifice. That's insanity. That is absolutely insanity.And that we actually what you said to us, that we see each other, that we see cops for the longest. I've never had any crime or was drunk. I never drank because I couldn't because one of my things and I had the same feeling. But you described.He's gonna give me a ticket. I never got into a fight with a cop I always talk to because I'm good human wise. So I talked to the cops. Yeah.And I changed my whole perception system conditioning that I had because that's over generation cops are assholes. Right? I mean over, over, over generations. And, and I had to be aware of that. And as I saying, you become aware of that if you focus on humanity.They are the best people. And you know what? It's funny. I just talked to a Navy SEAL and he was in love with the. He was in love with artist.I said, do you know, I love it because you're so similar. You're so similar. You are a real human. Where do you find real human? Most people go in the jobs to make money.These people are having a human feeling to be part of humanity. And both have the artists as the thing and they don't do it for money. Otherwise artists will be all rich and cops will be all rich, you know.

Exactly. Exactly. Well, yeah, they don't pay soldiers very much. They don't pay cops very much. We do it because we do it. Or artists.We do it because we have a passion in it. Like you said, it's within our soul. That's what we chose to do. It's within our soul. We want that human connection.I love part of my job I loved was what, what they now call community oriented policing. Yeah, back when I was doing it, they were just starting that.I like to park my car and I would walk downtown and I would talk to people and I would ask the kids how they're doing, ask the people how they're doing. I would walk into shops and ask how their day was going to house business.I made it a point to connect with those human beings within my district, within my beat, and I love that part of it. I would sit on a bench, have a cup of coffee, and I would talk to people because that's what I wanted, to connect with those individuals.Later in life, I found out that that allowed me to create this podcast, that part of my law enforcement career. And then the ability, and like you said earlier, I think in my notes, you've got your salvation. You found your salvation through art.I found my salvation through creativity in the same respect with communicating with my podcast, which is similar to art, similar to making a painting. It's just doing it verbally. And I was able to translate that into what I do now. And it has helped me and it gave me a new purpose.I don't make any money at it. As you said, I'm a starving artist. They gave me fulfillment, purpose.

The purpose you have, you have that. And you were not conscious, really conscious.You liked going and talking, drinking coffee with people, but now you are conscious of it with your podcast. You aware that this was something you always had in you. Like I say, we unveil ourselves. I hit the wall till I was 50.You know, you unveil yourself and then you find out it's all about humanity when you don't make your compass. Humanity and nature, we are still a part of nature, by the way. You know, let's forget that. If we don't make that, we will always be distracted.If I experience humanity through systems, that's why we are distorted. Because systems are so limited, we created them. We are the gods of systems, right? But we are not the gods of humans or nature.So we in systems, when we experience our human being through a system, then a protector, cop, a soldier, becomes an asshole. You Know in the perception. And he doesn't, you know, people are not aware what you guys do. Just to be there. Just to be.Just to be there and drink a cup of coffee. They have to think, oh, look at that, lazy. They're eating donuts and drinking coffee. It's completely insane.They give you a metaphorical experience, the other that you are safe.

Yeah, I agree with that. How do you think. That's probably the wrong phrase of a question.How do we as individuals, aside from like my own profession, in translating into what I'm doing now, how can we as an individual kind of dig deep within ourselves and understand that we all have this potential, whether in. It may not be to paint, it may not be to draw, but it may be music or it may be dance, or it may be performance art or something along that line.How do we recognize that within ourselves and say, hey, I think I really want to explore this.

I always say, I saw. When you have kids, give them, you know, don't buy an instrument. Don't buy a piano, a saxophone or anything. Just rent it as cheap as you can.Let them find themselves. Whatever resonates. Don't let him say, oh, I want to do violin. If you are not a. You know, if you're not.And then you play violin and nothing comes out, and then everybody. The feedback will be, oh, that's horrible. Because we always want acknowledgment and recognition from others.So use the instrument or the paint that fits you yourself, not that you get appreciation. So I loved guitar. I couldn't wait to get my own. I bought my own guitar.I learned classical guitar for two, two years and I couldn't get anywhere with it. So just to do art to please somebody or your perception of like is in a job, you think this is a good job, and then you hate the job. So it's, it's.It's important that you, you know, you use wherever you're drawn to. And then.And it's okay if I say I want to be a poet and then the right poetry, and I myself don't like the poet, the poetry, put it away, take it out in three months, and then you look at fresh. Don't throw it away and say, I'm not a poet. If you can't do an instrument like I. You don't have to wait three, two years to find out.That's really hard. And you only can do four chords change to another. In my case, I. A friend of mine asked me to do percussion and I was a viator.Also, I got invited to play with people. I played in bands, had my own bands, I made my own cd, but I could four chords on the guitar. So it's such a metaphor in this story.You see what a metaphor? Art creating is to find yourself, because basically you want to contribute with your strengths to humanity. And that doesn't have to look in any way.It's your strengths. The guy that sits on the streets and is a beggar contributes to society because it reminds everybody we can end up like this if we don't watch out.But he's unaware of it, obviously. And that's the sad thing. The sad thing of a poor person is not that he has no money. The sad thing is he's not aware that.That he has human impact on the whole. And those are the things. That's why I say if you just work in the garden, that's art. If you just think on your car and do it.So to be fulfilled, your gauge is the fulfillment. And the fulfillment needs to be in the process. It can't be, I need to win an Oscar or a Grammy or I need to be the best painter in the world.That the journey. If you don't have fulfillment in your journey, like you like to be a cop, then don't do it, don't be a cop.Then if you don't and not fulfilled in every day needs to be fulfilled. Do you have ups and down? Absolutely. Every living being on this planet has challenges, but you don't have to sacrifice yourself.You then have to suffer through something to find the end. Because you don't know in a minute you can be dead. So you said, okay, now I have spent 18 years to get to this, to this level, and I'm dying.So the fulfillment is your gauge. The fulfillment is humanity. And try to be fulfilled. Try to find gauge that feeling in you. Does that fulfill me? Does this make sense still for me?Not sense, because sense is logic. Does it fulfill you? You say you don't make money and what fulfills you, you make for no money. You make art because it fulfills you.That's why 97 I thought, oh, the systems are so bad. They, they, they disregard artists. No, no. Artists have connected with what you have connected with your podcast. It's fulfilling doing it.Being a human by doing this fulfills me. The money is secondary and if the money comes, it comes. Money is always a symptom, it's never the cause. So that's an easy.

That's a nice analogy to put it that way. I know that that kind of relates to. You have a, you have a quote that you had mentioned here. But the compass is your compass.Is our humans limitless in nature's sense of balance? I think that we all in life seek balance. You know, we always try to do a work life balance where we try to do a family, a family balance.You know, when you. We have two kids and you know, you're always trying to balance. You can't give more love to one kid in favor over the other kid.You have to give them equal time. You have to give them equal opportunity to grow and to explore and to know that they're loved equally and for who they are and what they are.There are some people that say, well, you're my favorite. You're my favorite. You're not my favorite. And that creates an environment within somebody to limit their possibility to move forward. Forward.And it does that aside from even being a parent. I think as you said earlier, systems within society. Our society has created limits on us. Our society has created boundaries on us.And it doesn't allow us to understand what our. Sometimes, what our true purpose is, number one. And sometimes it limits us in believing within ourselves that what we are capable of doing.

I'm so happy you said that with your daughters. It's not. This is systems thinking. This is how much I show.This is great that we show this in this context because our system has conditioned us so much that we even speak in. And you are more system relevant. That's why you speak more system than I do. So you say, I came to him equally. No, you can't. You, you can.How can you ever be equal to your. Both daughters? They're different human beings. Every human being is one of one. And that's for cops and soldiers. The same thing.You know, one, one, one guy you yell at and the next one you don't even say anything. And he can. But the system wants us to create a new system. Political correct, political doing this, this is to do everybody the same.Equality doesn't exist in nature. And the elephant and the ant are not in competition. They are that everybody has its purpose.So if your daughter ever said you love her better, you say, no, I love her differently than you. Because you're a different person.

Different person. It's apparent when you raise kids. You understand.

Yeah.

Each one of them are different. One, one. I mean, it's like night and day when you look at your kids sometimes, you know, we, we are grateful and very blessed with two kids.We're very grateful for having both of them in our lives. But they both have their own strengths, their own weaknesses, their own advantages, their own troubles, their own.You know, each one of them has their own one. One is a creative individual within the digital media field. One is an actor from that perspective. So they both are in creative fields, but they're.They're in different modalities from that perspective.

But it makes it good that they aren't creative fields, makes it very good between you and them, in between everybody, because that's. And now you become aware. So the system requires for you as a cop, to be equal to everybody.Now that are your kids from your family, and you have two kids and you can't be equal to them.

Exactly. It's not that I love as much.

As you want as much as you want, but what does the system require? The system requires you to be equal to everyone. And that doesn't work. You have to be human to everyone. Not equal.

100%.

Everyone is a human.

You're going to love this. My.My philosophy when I was a law enforcement officer was, I will treat you with respect in everything about you for as long as you treat me with the same. Once that changes, then my respect or treatment of you is going to be different. I will treat you like a human being until you stop acting like one.

Exactly.

And I've told people that when I was on the street, I'm going, you know, when they started getting in my face, they started getting violent. They started. I said, I'm going to treat you like a human being until you treat me differently.If you treat me differently, then the level is going to change. I am grateful that I've actually had felons. And I don't mind bragging about this.I had felons that literally wrote me and sent me a card from prison that said, I want to thank you for treating me like a human being instead of a felon. I committed a felony. I made a mistake. You helped me to understand that. And now I'm understanding that I have consequences for my actions.But I want to say thank you for treating me like a human being, not just a criminal or a felon. And I tried to. I grew up with my kids the same way. Like I said, I love my kids. I love them equally, but in different ways.I love my oldest daughter for strengths and weaknesses that she has. I love my youngest daughter for the strengths and weaknesses she has. So it's. There is a balance there. There is a balance there.And I know that we all balance automatically.

When you're human, it's automatically. Yeah, you just have to recognize systemic. It's not systemic. It's not. But if you treat any race. Look, we were segregated by systems.The king that, that, the first king, whatever, he needed to get a, you know, get another tribe or get another country. And he said, what am I doing? I need soldiers. They are their hardest thing.So I'm gonna just separate soldiers from, you know, in the old traps, you know, woman and man fought and I separate them into man and woman. That's the first segregation. Then, oh my God, we conquered other lands. They look different. Racism third.And now systems currently wanted to separate us and categorize us in sexuality. And there they hit the wall because everybody's unique, one of one and we are too fluid to be categorized in sex.That's why you have lbgt, which blah blah blah, the whole Alphabet. You could, and it wouldn't be enough. You could put just say A to Z plus and all signs and it would not be enough. Because even language is limited.But art isn't, because art goes to all senses. And that's why it is such a great godly discipline. And people recognize when they look at something and, and, and, and there's a clear communication.I always explain what art is. Art is a conversation from a human being to its non physical, between its non physical and physical.The product of that conversation is the piece of art, the music, the, the, the song, the podcast.And if it's clear enough, if it's, if it's refined enough, then people recognize it and say, oh, I want to listen to more of Michael's shows or you know, podcast episodes, the more you refine your communication with your, where you go at night, you know, you sleep. You're not in, in the physical, you're in the physical, but you're not. Your focus is on the physical.So the non physical and the physical communication is the art piece. And that's, and that's when the clearer we are about and, but that comes from humans. That comes. That is a human business.Art as well as soldiering is a human business. This was systemized. That's why you have 97% of artists poor and cops poor and soldiers poor. Systemic.Because the relevance in this, in the system is more money versus. Versus what, what these humans actually do for humanity.

So yeah, that's an interesting perspective how you've explained all the interaction within that and how it's all interlaced. How could we heal?I mean, you make a statement that we could heal the world and others by everyone being the best you that each can be for yourself to contribute with each uniqueness seamlessly to the whole of humanity. How do we take the first steps in understanding how we can be the best you, the best me that I can be?

I'm all. I'm a strong proponent against steps, but I say the first step is just listen to this podcast. Because we. I'm living. You are living.We're living what we preach, and by that, you other people get the most out of it. It's just re. Listen. I sometimes listen to a podcast three or four times because I hear things that I haven't heard. And what that happens.What happens there is I become aware, and once I'm aware, you cannot make yourself unaware. You can learn a step. You can say the words, which is also systemic. You can say the words. Okay, first thing, I need to be grateful. What is that?That's a word. If you don't feel grateful, you can't make yourself feel grateful.You can be aware of what you have, and perhaps that conjures the feeling of gratefulness. Now find out how to connect to gratefulness. But don't just say, be grateful. Be mindful. Those are all systemic words for human stuff. I love this.They say actually in the military right now, I heard they wanted to say, when you ask an Asian person to help you with a math problem, that will trigger a micro emotion, a microaggression, and it's. It's. It should be avoided. Are you insane? Completely. That. First of all, microaggression is a psychological. It's a. It's a. It's a systemic word.There's no such thing in microaggression. There's jealousy in humans. Humans, there's anger in humans. There is basic, like 12 emotions.I think around that, that are basic human emotion, that every human on this planet feels. Those. We can talk about those. If I'm hurting you, we can talk about it because I know what hurt is. You know what hurt? This.But we have to explain, is it an ego? Hurt is another hurt. So all this, it is all human. Relevance is important, not system relevance. Not that I know. Oh, I cannot.This is a rule, a rule in regulations that you say, I cannot ask an Asian person for helping me with math. What about. I can ask every human being about a math problem except me.

I'm never good at it.

I'm horrible about it. But I'm saying I could ask. What about asking any race, any gender about anything we want?

I agree with that. I think that we sometimes forget we're all equal.

We're all one.

We're all one. It's all together. How do you think, speaking of all being one, why does art and creativity always bring us closer to humanity? Speak.Because we just had this huge conversation about being human and humanity. And I understand it. But let's help those that are watching and listening to understand how art and creativity can bring us closer to humanity.

I think because creating is the essential community. And then creating through your project, through your podcast, through my paintings, through my music, it's our communication of your essence.We, art and creation. That's why it's the first superpower. It's our essence, our contribution to humanity, our short visit that we have here.It's the tool that, that is the. It is the most efficient tool to communicate and contribute your essence to this humanity.

And that makes, that does all the sense, right? It does. It actually does. I mean, I look at art, yes, I do have a master's degree in what I have, but it was a passion for me.I wanted to explore that. I wanted to open that door for numerous reasons. One, because I felt within side me that I wanted to be creative. I wanted to move forward in my life.And from that perspective, I took the steps that I felt were necessary to really help me unleash that creativity, to be able to open that door for me. Because I had been, I was a cop for a long time.You know, I've almost had about an 18 year career prior to me getting injured and having to leave that career. But before that I went to college to be a cop.So from that environment I'd been for a long time, I needed some help in to take that step, to open that creativity for me. And then once I did, I realized that I always had it within me, within myself anyway. I just had to recognize it and to move that forward.And I think a lot of us, especially in this day and age, which is unfortunate, this day and age, you get a lot of schools and academic institutions that are going, we're not going to fund the painting and the art and the creativity side of this. We're only going to fund the sports or athletic side of this. People can't see me, I'm doing my Italian hand gestures down here.We're not going to fund the art and creativity side of school anymore. That the kids had the opportunity to at a young age to explore painting and acting and singing and dancing, they start shutting that down.Do you think that is an issue that needs to be addressed in society as a whole?

Absolutely. And not because I'm for art to education, but I say it's an unawareness, first of all. It's an unawareness. That's our art education.Education is only bring. It's, It's. It's like 10 of what it could be.

Right?

So even if I gave him the time when we had the most art education, if I give him the same time, it's only 5, 10% of what it could be because it focuses on the product and the history of a product it, it teaches you about, but also it exposes you to art. And that's the only five. That's where the 5% is.So I, you know, when you do sports, you learn something in teamwork and achieving a goal, skill, strategy. Like cop, like the job of a cop. Right. Which I don't have because I'm not a cop. I haven't been a soldier. I have other skills.But there's a skill set you learn and what you learn in art, there is an awareness.So for example, if I'm a sports guy, if I'm like a football player, coaches or whatever, I'm in college, but at the same time I'm part of the theater group, I'm learning the skill of team of humanity. Again, I'm talking in the context of humanity, not I'm going to get a skill to make a lot of money. That.So I'm learning a skill of, of humanity, interaction, social. That's why education, what is education? The social. The social skills that you learn is, is all of it.It's not what, what you regurgitate with pills and everything that get you to regurgitate for one second and you forgot it. And when you have the balance, you need the, the masculine is the. Is the sports. The feminine is the balance. Right. Balance is the absolute. Exactly.It's the superpower of nature. Look, dinosaurs live the species. Nature went on, it lives, it lives without humans too. It just adapts.So when you have the thing, and I always keep saying this in with CEOs, you know, I tell him, I said, you need to really do, do start in a theater group or something or be in the art community. Because you have two leads even you have two leads. Yeah, the CEO and the cfo. Right. You have two leads in a play.But if anything, what does the CFO and the CEO have? No clue what the street. Street. Even in cops, what the street cops go through, they say, okay, I went to police academy.They never even what the street beat Philip Epson or so. So in a play, the Whole two, even after two, you get Lujo, you get Pavarotti and you get whatever.And these people, when they not interacting with the whole team in, in that it's important that everybody's relevant. Why every and one thing everybody supports the. In sports is similar, but everybody supports more on a logistic level. But you have to really interact.You have to know what everybody does.

Right.

So in sports the whole team supports the running back or the quarterback. Right. But in, in, in, in the theater, this, the whole thing has to gel.

The whole ensemble has to work together.

Yeah. If, if, if, if the violinist is off, the whole 140 people in the orchestra, it's, it's void. It's void. One person is.So everybody has to get each other. So that's. And actually those are the essence of, of school. There should be sports and art. I wouldn't even do any.And basic math, you're learning in grade school. I think there should be sports and art and you should be. Everybody should be mandatory to do both.

I agree.

And you're not learning to make money. You're learning to be a productive, contributing human being as part of this weave. And this is living, lifting the human potential versus, versus.Just saying, hey, let's do it. Okay. My dad did that. You do the same. You know, the next generation do the same. They're the same.

I agree with that.

Experience. Experience it like you experience cop. Experience that teamwork. God.I think there's so much in soldiering and I have not been on a human level that you learn, you know, and like you said, you like to drink coffee with the people in the street. Wonderful. And I've learned so much from, you know, trying to get into the system and couldn't. But in the, in the art system, it didn't matter.It didn't matter if it was this like stick in the art system, you know, the nature is not. It doesn't matter if you have three like a three legged gazelle, it still keeps going or, you know, it doesn't matter. Everybody has a part of it.

Everybody has a part. Everybody plays a part in society. Everybody's a part. Everybody plays a part in human. Humankind.You know, I could talk to you for a whole another hour. You're gonna have to come again, Michael. You're gonna have to come back on this show. We're gonna have to continue this conversation.But right now we're kind of. We're running questions. Yeah, we're running, running a little over time.So let's talk about how somebody can find you and how they can connect with you and get your books. Because I know you've got five books. I've only put three of them up here. And you have a podcast.Can we talk a little bit about that and how to get a hold.

Of you so you can go. I have one hub, that's michaelm.com which is Michael with two L's m.com michaelm.com and the podcast is, is. Is basically all the wisdom and aware.Because I believe once you're aware, you can make yourself unaware. So the podcast is just 20 to 30 seconds long, one episode.And everybody that wants to get into art and likes this podcast episode and what we said and it resonates with you. Go and just listen to one a day. Just one quote a day. 20 seconds. And there's a question too. Answer the question for yourself.There's no test or anything. And then let it percolate, Let it percolate. Next day, go the next. It doesn't matter if something comes or not. Just go. Next question, next question.Sometimes after 10 different. You will get you there will. The lightning will come.The lightning, the awareness will come and you will look at humanity and, and art, art and creating in a different way. You're not, you're not think, oh, I need to love Michelangelo or I need to love Rembrandt more than the finger paintings of my kids.It will put it all in perspective that you say that. You see, oh, it's about the product. It's a system thing. It's like going in a Walmart and buying art. Or it is. It is the creation.And that the creation is, is the journey. It's the rewarding thing for humans.

And your books, your books and your podcast can all be found on your website as well. So they have links to there. And I'll make sure that all that's in the show notes so that everybody has an easy way to access.Just click, click the link in the show notes. It'll take you right to your website so they can get more involved. Michael, this has been a fantastic conversation.I honestly appreciate you coming on board.

Thank you so much.

I hope that we've had the opportunity to educate and motivate and inspire, inspire some people to explore their own creativity. This is one more thing before you go. Do you have any words of wisdom before we go?

Awareness is everything. Because if you want to find yourself and find fulfillment, you cannot find it through knowledge. Because you can do all this.You can do everything the system tells you and you can and awareness is basically the language of humans that actually leads us to wisdom. So you gotta be aware and to find awareness is feel fulfillment. Don't have an intuition, all that stuff, that systemic, insistent spirituality.Pray to God, whatever. Just feel, as I'm talking purely human level. Feel the fulfillment to chase that feeling, not the fulfillment. I'm getting drunk.That is not fulfilling. Because at the end, fulfillment has no downside. Fulfillment is just fulfillment.It just gives more and more and more and become aware of it and focus and aware you become when you focus on humans and nature primarily and then secondarily think about paying our rent. Systemic.

Brilliant words of wisdom. I applaud you for those as they have brilliant words of wisdom. Thank you very much again.I appreciate you coming on board to the show and I look forward to having another conversation with you. I think we can really kind of expand people's opportunity a little bit more. So thank you very much for being here.I hope that you have a wonderful day and I look forward to having another conversation.

Thank you.

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